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Photoshop, damage, or real?


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#1 Nelson

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 07:47 PM

Browsing aquabid and saw this guy advertised as "Sickle Finned Copper DT Male". Obviously not a double tail so I don't know where they got that from. Personally, I keep going between thinking it's naturally that way, someone cut his fins, or it's just odd tail damage. So what do you guys think?
http://www.aquabid.c...asdt
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#2 Maryanne

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 08:07 PM

I believe that seller is Irchin, so he can tell me if I'm right in my guessing of the lineage of this fish.

What that looks like to me is a plakat that came from a spawn that had longfinned fish crossed into it, so either longfinned parents that carried plakat or plakats that came from longfinned parents at one point.

The reason I say this is often when you cross plakat into a longfinned line, you get longer than average anal fins. I feel like whatever gene was responsible for elongating this gene was then passed back along with the plakat and created a short plakat caudal fin and a longer anal/dorsal fin.

It does not look like damage to me, but just an odd presentation of crossing longfinned and plakat lines probably for color reasons.

He is a double tail. He just has a mitten butt :D The upper lobe is shorter than the bottom. This could also help contribute to the shorter look of the caudal fin.

#3 Nelson

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 12:31 PM

Really? The dorsal doesn't seem very large to me. I guess it's not impossible though.

#4 Maryanne

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 01:42 PM

The dorsal is large for a plakat. Look at how far the longest ray goes! Not for a longfinned fish, though. It does indeed have enough rays in the dorsal to be a double tail, it is just weird in that it doesn't have the traditional shape of a DT dorsal. It has more of the flame shape of a VT dorsal. I just think a lot of different fish went into the making of this interesting little guy :)

#5 Jeremy

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 02:05 PM

On the subject of the dorsal, an extended dorsal is usually greater than 8 original rays so if you have more than that it's usually a safe bet to say DT was crossed into the line somewhere.

#6 Nelson

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 09:56 PM

If you cross veil tails and plakats wouldn't you get just one or the other? I'm not too savvy on betta genetics. lol

#7 Maryanne

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 10:57 PM

If you crossed veiltails with plakats you would get veiltails. But they wouldn't look exactly the same as the parent's form. There are thousands of genes at work to give a fish a certain look, it isn't as simple as the punnet squares make it out to be.

#8 Irchin

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Posted 29 July 2011 - 12:13 AM

Here are but a few odd tailed Doubletails and in some cases Tripletails from my Betta room. I guess it comes with the territory and I consider myself lucky that that is all the deformities I get. Most forums talk about how many bent spines and other abnormalities that come from breeding Doubletails. It must be my breeding program that gives me so few malformed individuals. The one in question is from a Tripletail spawn and he just never grew his tail out but made up for it in the anal and dorsal fins. A customer recently pointed out the fact that I was the only seller that had a Copper Yellow line which this one came from. I really don't know the answer to that. Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image

#9 Nelson

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Posted 29 July 2011 - 11:50 AM

Crazy! Very interesting. I didn't even know there were triple tails.

#10 Irchin

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Posted 29 July 2011 - 01:45 PM

So far noone has a true breeding strain of them. They just show up in spawns occassionally. It seems to be happening more than just occassionally in my spawns. The Purpley Red ones I didn't even know had DT genes let alone Tri-tail. Red Dragon HM, Chocolate Veiltail; Copper SD and Platinum in their background that were all singletailed. Three generations later and Doubletails show up with a couple three tail looking ones. Go figure I guess? They all have a common ancestor from the original Green DT female I started this venture with 4 years ago.

Edited by Irchin, 29 July 2011 - 01:47 PM.


#11 ZiraCrownBetta

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Posted 20 November 2011 - 01:40 PM

the last two on the bottom are beautiful lol. and i love how unique they are. why dont you try breeding for triples? something new? with the second from the bottom its tail is so large and flowy it almost looks like a multicolored angel lol. Angeltails hahaha. anyways. that is neat on how they come about. if its a gift maybe you should look into it? improve it and release it to others? just a thought. but you might have something going there.

#12 Irchin

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Posted 20 November 2011 - 08:18 PM

I spawned the second to the bottom one to a same colored female. A few of the fry looked like they might have triple tails but not enough to pursue it. The one above and the one below him are from that spawn. They are fully grown now and just look like DT Veiltails.




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